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Oct 7th, 2008, 12:05pm
   Mischel Internet Security Forum
   Internet Security
   Firewalls
(Moderators: Helena, Gavin_Coe, Magnus)
   Rules - A lot of care goes a long way
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   Author  Topic: Rules - A lot of care goes a long way  (Read 723 times)
8Signs
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Rules - A lot of care goes a long way
« on: Oct 24th, 2003, 12:39am »
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After thinking of what I could offer all of you, who probably spend more time playing with firewalls than I do (coding doesn't count!  Grin), I've decided to share the "horror stories" of rulesets I've seen and problems I've had reported. These are related to rules-based firewalls, because that's been my thing.
 
1) No rules - not remotely right.  Wink
The Install Wizard for 8Signs (also VisNetic) Firewall has an option where the user can choose to create their rules later. The firewall starts with none, and everything is blocked by default. More than once I've seen  Cry tear-stained emails from people who were installing remotely and on reboot were locked out and had to call a local person to turn off the firewall.
 
So, we added a new Install Wizard option were the user
could choose to start with all traffic allowed. Problem solved.
 
2) No ARP rule - hey, what just happened? Shocked
Some otherwise knowledgable people have reported the firewall working properly and then after a few minutes "it forgets all the rules and blocks everything Angry"
 
After the first anxious time, I've learned to politely ask if there is an ARP rule. ARP isn't something people talk about a lot, but if the firewall starts with it off by default, you get trouble pretty soon. It's tricky because if you have just started the firewall, IPs will be in the ARP cache and the problem won't happen right away. Stop the firewall and the problem goes away.
 
FYI, ARP is the Ethernet protocol that lets you find the system with a certain IP. IP packets are sent within Ethernet packets and Ethernet packets need Ethernet ("MAC") addresses. ARP says "Hey, IP #.#.#.#, what's your MAC address?". The reply comes back, "I'm IP #.#.#.#, and my MAC address is XX-XX-XX-XX-XX-XX.". The MAC address is saved temporarily in the "ARP cache" (at a DOS prompt, type "arp -a") but the entries are purged over time and the ARP request must be made again.
 
3) Wide-open rules -  pardon me, but are those your ports hanging out? Embarassed
Occasionally, people send me their ruleset with regard to a question. I look them over and sometimes am shocked  Shocked (OK, well not really, more like this Roll Eyes ) to find rules that allow access from all IP addresses to all their ports. Sometimes it's not that extreme. It might require the outsider to choose source port or a small range. 8Signs Firewall has a visual display (on the Configuration screen) of port usage as an attempt to help users spot gross errors such as this. If your local ports display shows up in bright green, you're exposed and it will show the rule(s) that's doing it.
 
4) Pages of rules - I don't think we're in Kansas anymore, Toto  Huh
There may be cases where this is necessary, but I've always viewed it as either a warning the user is confused or that the firewall needs a better way to handle their needs. The danger of having lots of rules is that you may lose your understanding of exactly what's getting allowed. Second to that, you pay a price in performance, because each rule must be checked (if there is not match).
 
The next release of 8Signs Firewall includes IP, Port and MAC groups (it's already in some other firewalls) so that one rule can do the job that several used to. This should go a long way to making rulesets concise.
 
James Grant
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Re: Rules - A lot of care goes a long way
« Reply #1 on: Oct 24th, 2003, 1:28am »
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 Hello  ,  James
 
  Really  nice  to  have  you  posting   at  TH's Forum.
  I  think  we  all here  could  learn  a  lot  from  you  don't  matter  what  FW  we  are using .
  So  ,  when  not  coding  why  not posting  ?
 
  Regards  ,
 
    mozar
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Re: Rules - A lot of care goes a long way
« Reply #2 on: Oct 24th, 2003, 2:34am »
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Regarding the ARP thing, is there anything that WiFi (WLAN) networks will have to accomodate? AFAIK, there has to be 'portability' of the MAC address between, for example, different access points. Even if a laptop doesn't move physically, it may lie at an intersection of two or three APs and may be electronically punted between them depending on system load.
 
Maybe I'm not quite right yet on this thing, but there are some issues with the WiFi hardware. One is that the MAC address can be reset using a software app. Another is that the same MAC address (i.e. the WiFi adapter and its laptop host) can move between APs, but needs to keep the session open so the connection is not lost when on the move. I suspect that this portability is one reason why I was seeing a lot of ARP traffic (avg about 2/second) in some of the test firewalls.
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Re: Rules - A lot of care goes a long way
« Reply #3 on: Oct 24th, 2003, 3:04am »
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I don't know enough about WiFi to answer confidently, but I think the frequent ARP is a way the AP forces systems to use the right one. Your connections are with a remote IP, not with the AP. When your ARP packet says "who is IP #.#.#.#?", the APs must be deciding which of them will answer.
 
James Grant
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Re: Rules - A lot of care goes a long way
« Reply #4 on: Oct 24th, 2003, 5:25am »
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ARP Rule Restrictions;
 
Yea I know about that, you create two rules with Look ‘n’ Stop to:
 
- authorize ARP Broadcast Requests to the Gateway  
- authorize ARP Broadcast Replies from the Gateway
 
And boys it’s beautiful you can see all the necessary ARP blockings…
 
Though the ARP setup was a problem for few; these people had certain Routers which sends the ARP Broadcast Requests and you need to authorize that and authorize ARP Broadcast Replies back out to the Router. This pretty much beats ARP Rule restrictions on those people…
 
In the upcoming release there will be a beautiful treat regarding this… Smiley
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Re: Rules - A lot of care goes a long way
« Reply #5 on: Oct 24th, 2003, 5:27am »
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eeeek; "Unnecessary ARP blockings" even...
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Re: Rules - A lot of care goes a long way
« Reply #6 on: Oct 25th, 2003, 2:50pm »
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Thanks guys. I'll examine the rules again. Of course, the clumsy way around this is to just stop filtering the WiFi link...
 
 
 
LOL. Never choosing that method!!!!!
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